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A crappy subject
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steve19438    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:08:39       [Reply]  [Send Email]
one of our 40 year old toilets needs to be replaced. i have heard nightmare stories about the newer lower water volume toilets; mostly that they do not flush well with one push of the handle.
would any of you like to reccommend a brand that flushes well with a single push of the handle.

Dave2N    Posted 01-04-2005 at 18:53:24       [Reply]  [Send Email]

Check into TOTO toilets. Low water volume but they flush like mad.

Don't buy Eljer!    Posted 01-04-2005 at 17:40:57       [Reply]  [No Email]
I have a new 1.6 gallon Kohler in one bathroom. I replaced the toilet from the previous owners because it was stained, and although I realize I might have got the stains out with pumice it was just too nasty (someone else's toilet - ick).

The Kohler works great! Even with two just turned 4 year olds that have been known to flush too much paper and a toy or two.

The other bathroom has an Eljer also 1.6 gal. What a piece of junk! It clogs if you look at it funny. I have pulled it and hosed it and it still takes two flushes - for yellow.


Willy-N    Posted 01-04-2005 at 17:59:21       [Reply]  [No Email]
Those are the ones I have. I just removed the cup inside that causes the volume to be less. I have used them for 8 years with no problems. When I got them it was a joke how much water was used. I at least wanted enought water to flow to the tank 250 ft away! Mark H.

Zenia    Posted 01-04-2005 at 18:27:58       [Reply]  [No Email]
How did you get that cup out? That's the problem right there. I should have removed it when I pulled the toilet. I broke the plastic down one side but it seems like I would have to pull out the tank to get that thing out, then I wondered about wrecking the seal at the bottom of the tank. I guess I could cut it out somehow, leaving a circle of plastic in place? (the bottom of the cup?) I'm not explaining well, but I think you know what I'm talking about? I think that cup thingy reduces the flow to about .6 gallons...

Willy-N    Posted 01-04-2005 at 21:57:14       [Reply]  [No Email]
That is what I did just busted up the cup till it could not hold water anymore. The cup holds water and weighs down the flapper and closes the valve sooner not letting the water out of the tank all the way. I just busted the sides off so it could not hold water anymore and it worked for me. I also adjuted the level in the tank to max befor shut off happens. Mark H.

Hal/WA    Posted 01-04-2005 at 15:18:04       [Reply]  [No Email]
You don't say why the old toilet needs to be replaced. I would say that unless it is actually broken, just repair or replace the parts that are causing trouble. The old toilets worked much better than the reasonably priced low flow models I have had experience with.

About 8 years ago I had a house built, and of course they had the @#$%^ 1.6 gallon toilets, because that was what was available as new assemblies at the time. We learned pretty quick that it was NECESSARY to have a plunger very handy at all times, because you would be needing it every other time it was flushed with any amount of toilet paper in the bowl. We put up with this for several years and it worked OK unless we had company--they always plugged it up. I finally put printed instructions up in the guest bathroom about how to flush the toilet. But they were not always followed. Then a couple of years ago, my Mother In Law, who is elderly and a bit senile, came to live with us. She could never get the flushing routine right and plugged the toilet numerous times. What was even worse, was that about once a week, she ran the toilet over and didn't always tell us right away.

I had heard that old fashioned toilets were still available in Canada, but the stores I checked with only had 1.6 gallon models. I had to do something, so I went to St Vincent DePaul and bought the best used toilet I found there. It had the build date of 1968 inside the tank. I added all new parts inside the tank and a new floor seal and installed it in the guest bathroom. My MIL has only plugged it once since then and never ran it over. I have since replaced the other 2 toilets in the remaining bathrooms with old toilets. I have had absolutely no problems with toilets since then.

My replacement toilets have each cost about $30 to buy and about $15 to rebuild and install. One of them required a bunch of work with strong bowl cleaner to get the bowl looking good. Now the toilets look new and unless I told someone or they looked closely, it would be impossible to tell that they had been used somewhere else for many years.

In looking at the removed toilets, I can see why they were so easy to plug. The path that the solids and liquid that you are trying to flush has to follow is about half the diameter of the path in the old fashioned toilets. Plus at the flange where the toilet matches up with the wax seal, the passage has been necked down even more, with a flat area that seemed to catch anything that was very solid. I think that the toilet manufacturer was trying to get enough velocity with the smaller volume flush to get a proper flush by decreasing the passage volume. In the tank, the manufacturer installed a smaller volume container so that each flush would be about 1.6 gallons But this didn't work very well in acual practice.

Maybe you could find a new toilet that worked reliably if you spend more money. Some of them have air assist and other modifications to do a better job of flushing. I do not have experience with these new high priced toilets, but have read about them.

But I would not recommend buying a regular 1.6 gallon flush toilet that costs about $50 to $100. You will regret the purchase.....they are JUNK!

It is not hard to fix a toilet unless the porcelein is broken. Most decent sized hardware stores will have everything you need. And if it is the tank that is broken, tanks can be replaced easily.

You also might want to try to find a good used toilet. I think the best ones were the "siphon jet" models from the 70's and 80's--they seldom plugged and are new enough so they might not be scratched up too bad.

Good luck, toilet problems are a real hassle!

tacon1    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:53:03       [Reply]  [No Email]
I replaced one of ours with a Kohler and it works great...gonna change the other two also. I saw a home improvement TV show where they had a film from the factory where they made them and the designer explained how the changes were made internally so that using less water they actually flush faster and better than the older ones. It's true, this one is much better than our older ones and hardly ever needs to be double flushed. The older ones do.

gary    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:35:38       [Reply]  [Send Email]
As a licensed master plumber I would suggest you check out the Toto Drake. We have had minimal problems with this model. I used them in my house!

mud    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:34:20       [Reply]  [No Email]
dont buy the cheap ones. you will get the results some folks below have mentioned.

kohler has a good one. i have installed many without complaint.

Willy-N    Posted 01-04-2005 at 17:06:48       [Reply]  [No Email]
When I built my new home they required them. So I bought the new 1.6 gal ones and removed the device that restricks the amount of water used. It is just a canister that fills with water and closes off the outlet faster. I broke the sides off of it and it uses the whole tank to flush now. Never had a problem and the building dept saw the water saver lables and never knew the differents! I pump my water from my well so I figure it is going back in the ground so where is the waste? Mark H.

Gerrit    Posted 01-04-2005 at 16:21:54       [Reply]  [No Email]
Exactly what I was going to say.. I installed some of those - happy customrs all over :-)

toolman    Posted 01-04-2005 at 17:02:43       [Reply]  [No Email]
they put them in our house when they built in a few years ago and they work fine, guess it helps if your not full of crap too lol.

KellyGa    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:21:06       [Reply]  [No Email]
They do suck. The new ones do. We have an original old toilet in our house. The tank cracked, and we painstakingly glued it because we didn't want to get one of those toilets. I reckon before we move we will have to replace the tiolet with one of those jobs, but we don't want one for us if we can avoid it! Good Luck to you!

Archie    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:20:09       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Hi Steve We put in two new kohler stools about three years ago. They have done real good. One flush is all ours takes. We have a deep well and i got the kind where the water reservoir is lined with styrofoam and they do not sweat at all from the cold water. Old stool used to drip water all time in summer. Archie

Clipper    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:14:16       [Reply]  [No Email]
You can "special order" a high capacity toilet from Canada via Home Depot. Worth the extra $$ cuz they use more water than the ones now sold in this country.
And you can thank the idjits in Congress for mandating these miserable low-water consumption toilets now in place.....only our politicians can jam up the crap in our own homes!!

EngineerJoyce    Posted 01-04-2005 at 14:18:31       [Reply]  [No Email]
I find that our low-flow does just fine with the ...uh... more liquid deposits made. And for the ...uh... more solid deposits, I have found if you hold the handle down to continue the flush which nearly empties the bowl, you can still achieve proper ...uh... removal. 8-)

slim    Posted 01-05-2005 at 06:01:51       [Reply]  [No Email]
That's exactly what I have to do. Hold the handle down a few extra seconds and it works fine. Probably uses as much water as the old ones doing this.


Jet9N    Posted 01-04-2005 at 15:09:06       [Reply]  [No Email]
Gotta love that "tactful" explanation. LOL


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