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Country Discussion Topics
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Re : Terri Schiavo again
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mark    Posted 02-27-2005 at 10:39:18       [Reply]  [No Email]
The other day the topic of Terri Schiavo
came up, I've heard about it before but never
really paid much mind to it. I looked into the
story a bit and this is what I got out of it.
A young vibrant woman suffered a severe
brain injury, she's not on life support just a
feeding tube and she HASN'T been given the
benefit of REHAB. Please correct me if I'm
wrong.
Just from the little bits I've heard over the
years I was under the impression this woman
was basically comatose, strapped to
machines 24/7 no hope at all of being nothing
more than a flesh covered throw pillow.

I remember quite vividly a doctor standing at
the foot of my wife's hospital bed following her
stroke. He was looking at me, pointing at her
and he said " There is no intelligence left in
there ". Had I chose to listen to him we'd have
been in the same boat. Instead my wife was
given the benefit of REHAB. She had to
re-learn all the basics beginning with how to
eat. Even during rehab we were told she
would never go home. We kept at the intense
rehab anyway.

Because she was given a chance with
REHAB, she was able to come home and she
has returned to a functioning intelligent
person. Albeit she has a few physical
limitations but by learning how to re-map her
mind through rehab her intelligence level is
back to where it was before the stroke.... not
that it was ever gone she just needed help
making her brain figure out how to function
differently than it had before.


Dug    Posted 02-27-2005 at 19:44:55       [Reply]  [No Email]
Mark,

Your story is admirable and I certainly respect your integrity in honoring your committment to your wife. Perhaps, if Mr. Schiavo had done the same we would not be discussing this!

With that said, this case is a prime example why we all need a Living Will clearly stating our desires. My wife and I have done this and are confident we will make the best decision on the others behalf.

Personally, I have seen the conditional Terri is in, and have made my wishes very clear that I would not want to continue in that state!

Dug


mark    Posted 02-27-2005 at 20:19:15       [Reply]  [No Email]
I commend anyone who has the foresight to
write up the documents that remove that ugly
burden from their families. It's a tough thing to
do but well worth it for the families sake.


Melanie    Posted 02-27-2005 at 18:19:45       [Reply]  [No Email]
Yikes.
I personally wasn't speaking from a very informed position before (eek). But I will say that her story mostly just set me thinking about my life and my preferences, which was the main thrust of my previous post. My feelings were mostly defensive, in the sense that I would hate it if my family forced me to be alive if there was no hope for me to come back.
The topic itself got me asking, what would I want, if I were to be left in a vegetative state? And who has the right to decide that, if not me? I still stand by my initial salvo in terms of my own personal preference for me, although having looked at the links provided for Terri I have to revise my initial impression. Yes, she's in there. And yes, she should be given the opportunity to come back.
What surprises me is that, if these videos exist and the documentation exists to show that she has had no medical or therapeutic intervention, why are justices allowing the removal of the feeding tube? Is there still more we don't see?
Also, what is the difference between stroke-induced brain damage and the damage caused by the heart stopping? Any? None?


mark    Posted 02-27-2005 at 19:33:55       [Reply]  [No Email]
It's politics from what I gather.

A CVA is a CVA it's more about which parts of
the brain are affected and by how much. My
wife lost everything from an inch or two in front
of her left ear back.

The amazing thing about the brain is we use
so little of it and when things like this happen
the brain , over time, has the ability to rewire
itself and use other parts of itself that aren't
damaged. It just needs someone to help point
the way, once it figures out a new way to wire
it's off and running again.

i.e. The left side of your brain manages
speech. With Renee that part was destroyed.
But on the right side of your brain is an area
that collects songs and rhymes you learned
as a child. What the speech lady did with
Renee was teach her how to tap that storage
area and convert it to the new center for
speech.

Same with muscle movement. PT used sight
and feel to help with the rewire. They had her
watch in a mirror while she moved her left arm
at the same time trying to move her right. As
she's trying to move the arm they would tap
the muscle responsible for the movement.
Somehow the brain would figure out O.K. I'm
doing this for the left and I see it moves so I'll
try the same with the right and aim the
command to that muscle those folks are
tapping.


bulldinkie    Posted 02-27-2005 at 15:23:54       [Reply]  [Send Email]
That would be my worst nightmare for someone to just keep me alive.They said shes brain dead.I can see partents not wanting to let go,but this is no way to live.


Freakin A...    Posted 02-27-2005 at 16:40:14       [Reply]  [No Email]
See for yourself...

If you can watch these vids and in a good concience insist that this woman is 'brain-dead', I'll give you a real Cuban Cohiba, and shine your shoes...

I am betting that you can't do it, cuz no person with nothing to gain in this issue could...

Salmoneye, Who Says Poke Below...



mark    Posted 02-27-2005 at 15:50:22       [Reply]  [No Email]
Well like I said about my wife, she was pretty
much the same. She just needed rehab to get
back on her feet. Granted, back 15 yrs. ago
rehab was nothing like today but folks might
just be surprised with what happens if she's
given a chance with how rehab has evolved to
what it is now. Even the old myths about time
being a factor are getting blown out of the
water. The lady needs a chance.

My wife went from that kind of state to a
functioning person again thanks to the
outstanding Pros at the rehab hospital. I can't
give those folks enough praise for what they
were able to help my wife accomplish.


steve19438    Posted 02-27-2005 at 13:47:46       [Reply]  [Send Email]
my wife and i have discussed this situation many times and we have come a agreement.
if either one of us should end up like "TS" we will give the situation one year. if by then no improvement the plug gets pulled. i had to talk my wife into one year, she wanted three months.


Salmoneye, Upset...    Posted 02-27-2005 at 16:34:45       [Reply]  [No Email]
"my wife and i have discussed this situation many times and we have come a agreement.
if either one of us should end up like "TS" we will give the situation one year. if by then no improvement the plug gets pulled. i had to talk my wife into one year, she wanted three months."

Please follow the links and see this woman for yourselves...

I am glad that you insisted on a year...And I am sure that (unlike this a$$hole) she would give you every opportunity to 'come-back' by providing you with the PT, OT and 'REHAB' that you need and deserve...

For Pete's sake...We are not speaking about a person that has been given the chance of one year (let alone 3 months) to 'improve'...

The dip-stick husband has not allowed ANY rehab...

He has allowed her to deteriorate to the point where she has lost 5 teeth in three years...He has with-held even her 'feminine annual' cuz he refuses to agree or pay...

He is the lowest scum beyond scums...




Errin OH    Posted 02-27-2005 at 11:26:31       [Reply]  [No Email]
I didn't brother to respond earlier. But I find it interesting that 90% perfectly healthy functioning people will state "I don't what to live like that" and half of them will, or have, sign their life away. However given some time to adjust 99.9% of the disable are more than happy just to keep breathing.


Zenia    Posted 02-27-2005 at 11:01:36       [Reply]  [No Email]
You are awesome. It takes a lot of stength to do what you did for your wife. I commend you.

Honestly, the way my Durable Power of Attorney for Health Care and my Living Will are drawn up, I doubt that I would be given rehab. I have left the decision up to my two sisters and one of my brothers, and left any attending physician out of the equation. My family knows I do not want to exist as a vegetable. Your wife was lucky, it does not go so well for most. My understanding of the Schiavo case is that her brain activity was destroyed. She was not merely comotose, but in a persistant vegetative state. Big difference. My own father was disconnected from life support at age 49, three days after a stroke that ceased his brain activity except for autonomic response.


mark    Posted 02-27-2005 at 12:40:04       [Reply]  [No Email]
We have living wills ( or advanced directives )
too but like Errin said a person wants to fight
just to keep breathing. Without getting into
details, ours is written in such a way as to
allow every reasonable chance at life before a
plug is pulled.

If a person is brain dead then you have to let
them go. But if there's a spark, the
advancments that are being made with rehab
warrant giving the person every fighting
chance.


Gunner    Posted 02-27-2005 at 10:57:24       [Reply]  [No Email]
I'll never give up.


Ron/PA    Posted 02-27-2005 at 10:56:30       [Reply]  [No Email]
Unless something has changed, Terri is comotose. She's breathing on her own, but is fed by feeding tube. If you read the one side there has been no brain activity for a long time.
I don't know the answer to this situation, and I'm sure it's better suited to family than me. I do know that from "WHAT I'VE READ" there's no way for her to enter rehab because she has no brain activity.
Ron


Gunner    Posted 02-27-2005 at 12:14:32       [Reply]  [No Email]
I would never leave my wife - let alone pull the plug. He took an oath and should respect it




Les    Posted 02-27-2005 at 11:08:15       [Reply]  [No Email]
You are mistaken, Ron. When her mother walks into the room and she smiles, is that a sign of "no brain activity"?
Her husband just wants to be rid of her. You might want to follow the money on it as well.


Ron/PA    Posted 02-27-2005 at 14:05:58       [Reply]  [No Email]
I guess I should have qualified my statement with the fact that I haven't read all that much. I've always considered this a case of cash. I cannot understand the thought of removing a food source. To me, that's not being kept alive by artificial means. She is performing all of her normal body functions such as breathing. Our living wills exclude feeding tubes as means of heroic measures or extreme measures to keep us alive. I'm 100% with the parents on this one. The day I'm unable to be up and around, and Donna pulls my food, I'd be looking at the folks from nationwide to be on MY side.
Ron


Salmoneye    Posted 02-27-2005 at 11:20:01       [Reply]  [No Email]
I'm with Les on this one...

http://www.terrisfight.org/multimedia.html

On the right under 'Videos Of Terri'...Right click "Asked to open her eyes", and save to your desktop...Then open after it has downloaded and tell me that woman is in a coma...

You will need 'Real Player' to view the vids...



Hogman    Posted 02-27-2005 at 12:44:56       [Reply]  [No Email]
That Lady is alive! From Her appearance and Barring any other mitigating circumstances She should go on into rehab. You hate to think a person would choose somthing like this as a means of eliminating an unwanted spouse,but it is possible.Probable?


Salmoneye    Posted 02-27-2005 at 13:00:38       [Reply]  [No Email]
Think of where she would be today if she had been allowed rehab for the last 15 years...

Her husband has not even allowed the doctors to test her 'swallow reflex' to see if she can eat without a tube...

All they have to do is put food or liquid in her mouth to find out...He will not allow it...



toolman    Posted 02-27-2005 at 14:07:41       [Reply]  [No Email]
i think salmoneye and les are right i think the hubby has long since moved on and it has become a money issue to him,(if somebody offered him her ins. money would he care anymore) that aside look at terri, whats best for her, who has been by her side all this time day in an day out ,HER PARENTS thats who, they know her condition better than anyone even the doctors who get desentisived after dealing with situtations like this year in an out.the parents are willing to assume all responsibility (monentary etc.)the lady should have every chance at life.from what i have been able to follow on our news she is responsive to her parents, doesn,t sound to me like her brain isn,t working, life is precious and and when it is over ,its to late to second guess, i made a decision on my mom a couple of years back , my dad and brother and sis, went along with me but drug their heals about wheather we we,re doing the right thing,my bil said to be careful what you ask for when she took a bad turn , that statement still haunts me,i question myself often, i still think i did what was right for her and i was very very close to my mom,would i do the same again i hope i never have to go through something like that again, it never leaves you.whatever they do i hope the only thing that is considered is that lady , because she is the one that really counts.


Exactly the point...    Posted 02-27-2005 at 16:18:12       [Reply]  [No Email]
(if somebody offered him her ins. money would he care anymore)

The dic...I mean 'Husband'...Never mentioned his 'wifes' wishes until after the 2 (count em two) lawsuits were decided...They awarded him (collectively) over 2 Million Dollars US...Only after this did he announce his Wifes 'unwritten' wishes to 'die'...

Salmoneye, Who Is Willing To Keep Pushing This One


Hogman    Posted 02-27-2005 at 19:25:12       [Reply]  [No Email]
OKAY, I have known next to nothing about tha case so with what You Folks are telling Me the new thought would be that the SOB should be introduced to the supreme scrotal suspension system for...You mentioned 15 Years?Longer?


toolman    Posted 02-27-2005 at 19:28:11       [Reply]  [No Email]
yup but i think your going easy on him.


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