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Country Discussion Topics
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Racism....
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Cindi    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:10:45       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I can't be the only one going through this. I try so very hard not to judge anyone based on their nationality or religious beleifs but I find myself more and more, closely studying folks I meet, based on rumors and speculations.

I know a man who owns and operates a Shell Station in Sarasota. He's from Iraq. He's only been here a couple of years, but he knows my kids and I know his. He's always been very nice and freindly, but he owns a business so it behooves him to be that way. (See, there it is)

How do I know that he is not supporting Osama Bin Laden or Suddam Hussein? I don't. How do I know he's not smiling at me and thinking, 'white American bitc*'. I run into these folks all the time. Some of them seem to have an attitude. Many Americans have an attitude. Maybe having a bad day. Maybe didn't smile at me. Maybe wondering if I'm a fanatic that's going to rake him over the coals. Maybe thinking that my money is helping his war effort.

My normal first reaction to anyone, is to smile first. Beat 'em to it. Now I find myself going through this split second analysis as to whether I want to smile and maybe look like a stupid unsuspecting American forking over money to help attack America, or not smile and appear suspicious toward a contributing member of American society who may not have an evil bone in his body.


screaminghollow    Posted 03-05-2003 at 14:00:20       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I used to live outside of DC, Had Iranian neighbors on one side and Armenian on the other. Met several Iraqi's, Russian, Viets, Turks etc. Most of them came here for the same reason as my great-greats..... to make a better life. If they are taking on mortgages, buying houses and building businesses it's a fair bet the folks are here for legitimate purposes. Terrorists are here for one purpose, to scope and destroy. No roots are put down. They don't want to meet and make any American friends. A terrorist can't emotionally become attached to any of his targets or he loses some of his will to go forward with the scheme. Americans are a fairly gregarious bunch and, those immigrants who come here for legitimate purposes soon make attachments with some folks no matter how bigoted the area.
An Indian family purchased a small country grocery store near here a few years back, and some yahoo shot the windows out on September 14, 2001. The woman wears the dot on her head showing she's a Hindu. The person who shot out the windows must be dumber than dirt!
The types of terrorist we are talking about hate us because we let women drive, and girls go to school, and let women vote and work. If this guy was Al Qaida he wouldn't be working where he has to come into contact with women drivers.


Bandit    Posted 03-05-2003 at 11:02:41       [Reply]  [No Email]
You are worried about the guy that runs the srvice station.... What about the ppl your are talking to on here. You don't know what they look like, what their beliefs are, who they align themselves with. They could be sitting in a room ful of anti-american propoganda laughing at your crazy talk. Go on with your life, when your number is pulled, it's pulled, wether by terrorist or by getting hit with a truck.


bob ny    Posted 03-05-2003 at 11:20:59       [Reply]  [No Email]
i always wondered about being in a plane and the pilots time comes


Ludwig    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:05:19       [Reply]  [No Email]
Unabomber - Ted Kazinski(sp) - white.
Oklahoma City Bomber - Timothy McVeigh - white
16th Street Baptist Church bomber - Thomas Blanton Jr. - white

JFK murderer - Lee Harvey Oswald - white
Reagan shooter - John Hinckley Jr. - white
Abraham Lincolin murderer - John Wilkes Booth - white

Just because a man's white doesn't mean he's not capable of being horrible.


Duke Black    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:10:42       [Reply]  [No Email]
Hey ludy babe you forgot me in your list.


Guess I'm a Bigot,, Ron/PA LONG    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:55:12       [Reply]  [No Email]
While working at a job hauling fuel, I met a Pakistani, who explained to me that if he could lie to me, and steal even a dollar from me, that made him the better man, Didn't much like that sumbish,
I have a brother that thinks our farm is the greatest place in the world,, Butchering, harvesting, and hunting seasons. Not seen any other time of the year, Don't much like that sumbish (90% of the time)
I have been pee'd on from the shoulder down, by a cow, pooped on from top to bottom by a pig, and waded waste deep in chicken manure under a highrise layer house. Got no use for them sumbishes,,
I walked through an airport, returning from a government sponsered vacation, and was spit upon by my fellow americans while I was ordered to march "eyes front" by a 2nd luey,,,,,
Do I hate all Pakistani's, brothers, pigs, cows, chickens, or americans?? Of course not.
Am I a bigot, or a racist? Of course I am, by their definition, I have to be, If I disagree with even one of the above catagories.
I don't equate animals with people, I like most animals better,, but if I dislike someone because of their past,, I'm a bigot, or racist, or a butthead, but as long as I'm human I'll have these feelings.
If the whitest white, blackest black, or person of any color is rude to me or mine, or intentionally finds a way to dis me,, I'll dislike them or hate them for a long long time that makes me a racist, or bigot..
Sorry world but this lil ole human ain't perfect
Later
Ron


Ludwig    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:09:01       [Reply]  [No Email]
I dunno Ron, you sound okay in my book. Its okay to dislike or hate a person especially if they've done something bad to you or done something bad period.
Hating people because they're black or brown or yellow or arab or happen to come from Iraq is pretty wierd and dumb..


Bandit    Posted 03-05-2003 at 11:04:28       [Reply]  [No Email]
I agree, If someone walkes up to me and punches me, i don't hate his ethnic background, I hate him.


Duke Black    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:43:24       [Reply]  [No Email]
Why not go to another gas station owned by a race you approve of?


Cindi    Posted 03-05-2003 at 10:51:51       [Reply]  [No Email]
Who knows who owns what?


DW    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:41:21       [Reply]  [No Email]
What would Jesus do?


Corey    Posted 03-05-2003 at 09:15:46       [Reply]  [No Email]
The question maybe should be "What DID Jesus do?" Jesus was beaten, spit on, mocked, was scourged (a scourge is a whip with 3 to 9 strands that has glass, bone, animal teeth, or metal in each strand just to tear up flesh) then He suffered the pain and public humiliation of crucifixion (one of the most torturous deaths ever devised) and He did this on behalf of that same Arab man that owns that filling station. If I were to treat that man spitefully without cause, it sounds like I would be making myself an enemy of the One who gave His life for that man.


kraig WY Good question DW    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:54:18       [Reply]  [No Email]
Only we should ask that in every decision we make.


gregPA    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:19:57       [Reply]  [Send Email]
well here we go again. back in 1955 my family moved into southern york county PA. i was born then. my mom's side of the family is polish and we spoke polish at home with ENGLISH being the primary language. pop's side is native american and irish. he was 50/50. after i was born and began to grow as a very young child i was beaten many times because i was different. not color but my ethnic backround. the teenagers who beat me would threaten to kill me if i told how i got my beatings. after my mom finally saw all the bruises and swellings i couldn't hide it anymore. their next bag of tricks was to throw kerosene on me and lit matches. these beatings and abuse didn't stop until i got to be 6 foot 2 and 220. then things just became word battles. whencefore i don't give a dam* about racism. lincoln freed everyone over 100 years ago. what would happen if there was a WET network on tv. white entertainment television. there is BET and the latino networks. what about the jobs i was passed up on because i wasn't female, black, or hispanic. i had to train those people to do those jobs which they weren't qualified for. affirmative action my a**. the only way to get rid of racism is be AMERICAN and act AMERICAN. i don't have any slaves and my dad didn't have any but me. the majority of people in my area YORK PA that are crying about racism have never once been beaten or marked at any time of their lives. if they don't want racism then don't bring it into conversation and just act like human beings instead of martyrs. greg


screaminghollow    Posted 03-05-2003 at 14:10:05       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Greg, I'm in Red Lion. Moved here from Virginia. Where until the early seventies the inbound (to VA) buses stopped over the Potomac River so certain folks could go to the back of the bus. The racism I've seen in Southeast York County is currently so much worse than anything I've seen down South. What berg you from?


rhouston    Posted 03-05-2003 at 11:53:17       [Reply]  [No Email]
well said greg.


sHan    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:28:27       [Reply]  [No Email]
Im not a racist I say kill em all and let god sort em out!


Dunno what to tell you...    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:21:24       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Your thought process is so foreign to me on this...

But then...I come from the Whitest state in the union, and I don't get out much any more...

Wonder why my family has intermarried with people of various colours...Hmm...

Oh yeah...I remember...Damn pretty, exotic looking kids, who are the lights of our lives...Never mind...

Salmoneye The Colour Blind


Cindi    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:51:53       [Reply]  [No Email]
Salmoneye, I'm not talking about skin color, I'm talking about nationality regarding beleif.


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:26:32       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Um...

Bigotry takes many forms...Not just Racism...

First you state that the Man knows you and your children and vice versa...And that You smile at him...Then farther down you say:

"Now I find myself going through this split second analysis"...

Why?...Just because he is from Iraq?...Because he lives in a state frequented by the butt-heads that brought down the towers?...Because To, Ridge tells you to distrust your friends and neighbors?

Please do not get me wrong...I am one of the most cynical, distrusting SOB's to come down the pike...I just tend to not do my 'judging' based on what someone looks like or believes...Just how they treat me and mine...

Didja ever think of getting into a discussion with this Man about Saddam or his life before America?

May put your mind to rest...And you just may find an ally...You may also find someone that you do not want to associate with or whose business you may not want to patronize any more...

But you will never know till you ask...


Duke Black    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:52:24       [Reply]  [No Email]
What if he looks in your face smiles and lies?Lots of 2faced people arround.Who can we really trust today?


Greg VT    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:49:08       [Reply]  [Send Email]
If someone I don't know to well is always wearing a big smile when they talking to me... well that puts me on my guard from the git go.

I ain't that good looking or that interesting to talk to so if ya look like your having the time of your life talking to me then there's got to be more to the story then meets the eye.

Greg who tries to give folks the benefit of the doubt but don't trust very many of em.


Duke Black    Posted 03-05-2003 at 09:26:24       [Reply]  [No Email]
Give me the benefit when I'm on my tractor cuz I'll be smilin.


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:06:42       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I trust everyone till proven wrong...

Oh...except people that make up nicks to suit each post and don't put e-mail addresses...

Them I don't trust from the get-go...

;-)


Good Lord    Posted 03-05-2003 at 09:31:56       [Reply]  [No Email]
Just an FYI. I have changed my e-mail addy 3 times in 2 years because of spam and such. I depend on the e-mail for many things, and its a pain to change. Since I stopped posting it on most boards, I get no junk at all. I was considering changing my nickname here because this one seems, well, ?dumb? I guess I best leave it as is.
Paul.


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 09:38:20       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I kinda like your Nick...

And I do understand not posting your main addy on ANY board...However...I use a free Yahoo account just for the boards...That way if anyone wants to chat in private they can, and I just could care less about that account...Send all the spam anyone wants to there...Has a SPAM filter that works OK (not perfect) and I can be reached...

The people I have what I consider a 'relationship' with from the boards know my real name, and main address...Not like I am hard to find...

I tell everyone...Stop at the store...Head straight across the road to the Salmon coloured house...Ask for Jimmy...He'll size ya up and maybe he'll tell ya where I live...Maybe he won't...

;-)


Duke Black    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:27:13       [Reply]  [No Email]
Why dose the email thing bother you?If someone want to talk to me they can do it here.I don't like mail. Duke Black is the name.You like me better now?


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:30:19       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Is this a trick question?

;-)

PS...The little 'emoticon' with the grin and the winking eye means that the post is a jest or joke...Geeze...


Duke    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:37:33       [Reply]  [No Email]
I can't help it I'm a smarta$$,,,But I'm trying to be nice.It's hard for some of us.

;)


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:39:51       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Not a problem to me...I suffer from the same affliction...and it is a difficult subject...

All I can do is be the best me I can...

LMAO


Stan ETenn    Posted 03-05-2003 at 07:51:11       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Salmoneye, I agree with what you say. I think the biggest problem isn't skin color(rascism), but communication. Cindi, look at what you wrote. We can think anything, but we must communicate to know who or what people are. Everyone gets judged by their appearance. My thought is I want to know your heart. Some of the prettiest people have the blackest hearts. Some of the most precious people in the world would'nt think of entering a beauty contest. I say give people a chance until you know them, then make your best judgement. Peace, but don't tread on me.


Cindi    Posted 03-05-2003 at 10:49:43       [Reply]  [No Email]
I guess because of what Duke Black says. I could ask, but you know the man is going to be prepared with an answer, and maybe I like the guy just enough that I want to beleive the best and not have the image shattered by a stutter or a shifty look that might be a give-away, but may just be discomfort from being asked point blank if he has any ties to terrorism.

I think deep down what bothers me is even a slim chance that I might be supporting terrorism by patronizing certain businesses. I haven't found that 'happy place' where I can just not worry about it. I would feel like the ultimate traitor if I found out later that I made the wrong call. That's all.


Patria / PR    Posted 03-05-2003 at 18:30:45       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Search no more.

"happy place" = Puerto Rico

PS: ..but just between you and me girl...we're fricking crowded as it is..:-)



Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 12:06:07       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Cindi, last week you gave a guy a heart attack. This week you're supporting terrorism. Calm down, none of us are that important. Deep breath, oh yea, good to be you!


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:29:17       [Reply]  [Send Email]
When in New Orleans years ago on vacation a friend joined me. We went grocery shopping. He poked me and said to hurry up. I didn't get it. We were the only white people in this huge store and he couldn't take it. It had become a non issue for me. It was a good defining moment in my life. Like you Salmoneye where I come from we're pretty white. I had reached another plateau and it was a good one.


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:43:50       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I hung as a youth with a guy whose parents kept an apartment on 77th and broadway in NYC...About 17 we drove down alone for a Dead Show...got all turned around on the way in the city...Stopped at a place that had lights on at 1 AM...parked right in front...walked in...Music stopped...all heads turned...Bartender blinked a couple times and softly said 'I think you boys are in the wrong place'...We walked out back to the car...Everyone in the place happened to be black...

Police car pulled up beside us...Mid summer...all 4 windows in the car down...Officer in the police car opened his window maybe an inch (he happened to be black too)...Asked what the heck us white boys thought we were doing...Told him we were lost...Didn't even ask where we were trying to get...Told us to follow them...So we did...

We talked about that all night...Still will never understand...

2 kids lost in the night...what do I care what colour they are...They'll get directions and whatever help they may need...


Red Dave    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:13:25       [Reply]  [No Email]
I think that if he's from Irag and he's over here now, chances are it's because he's not a fan of Saddam.
I'd give him the benefit of the doubt concerning he is thinking, unless he gives good reason to believe otherwise. Besides, you are just there for a business transaction to buy gas.
I generally don't spend much time or effort worrying what other people think about me.


Tom A    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:42:14       [Reply]  [No Email]
I always have the same question in my mind. Probably stupid, but I try to make eye contact and say "hi" or "good morning" to everyone, always.

Well, though I live in the sticks, I work in an office building in the big city. There's some folks in the building who "don't look like me" (I've got light complexion and blue eyes). Some of them seem to have an attitude about white guys...they'll say "hi" to each other and totally ignore me. Often they look right at me when I say "hi" and not say a word or even a grunt, or else frown. Once though, I purposely held the elevator for one and that lady suddenly became very friendly and nice...at least for that day.

You can't help how you think; I still wonder every time whether to bother saying hi to some of these folks or not. Don't know, but I was taught that you treat all folks as you'd like to be treated and that's how I do...unless they do something that hurts me or mine, then watch out!

Tom


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:55:06       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Tom, some of my most uncomfortable moments were when I was younger and spent time in Ft. Lauderdale during spring break. All those college kids that looked "like that". Couldn't get to Daytona for Bike Week fast enough! Felt at home.


my most uncomfortable moment....    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:05:54       [Reply]  [No Email]
actually came when I was about 18 or 19.

Before I went to college, I had below-shoulder-length frizzy hair, as was the style in those days.

Went to West Point in '75 and got a very short haircut...very '50s look. One day, while on leave, I went back to a bar/pool-hall that I used to go to when I was a long-hair. I walked in the door and the place went absolutely *silent.* Folks quite drinking, playing pool and just stared at me like I was the man on the moon. Stayed quiet like that for about a full minute.

I had a quick beer (by myself) and left and ain't been back. oh well, so much for tolerance, eh? :-)

Tom


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:16:41       [Reply]  [Send Email]
About 25 years ago a girlfriend who had never seen me without a beard asked me to shave. So I did. She looked at me and said, "Grow it back". I haven't shaved since!


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:45:36       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I don't have a problem with anyone...

Till they Dis me...then I have a very long memory...


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:30:38       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Cindi, perhaps the guy that owns the Shell station is wondering which American will take it on himself to attack him for being here. Probably scary right now for a lot of people.
I had a lot of problems when I was younger with the way people looked at me. Long hair, biker type would best describe it. Even got a gun pulled on us in FL one year by a campground worker. But then again we were putting on warmer clothes for the ride, guess that was pretty scary.
I still look that way, now with dreds.


bob ny    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:53:50       [Reply]  [No Email]
i have deds too
i dred getting up on a rainy day
i dred doing certian chores
i dred going shoping with the wife


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:41:20       [Reply]  [Send Email]
One more dread, going out now in this ice to sand a customers walkway.


LOL!    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:41:06       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Jah Rastafari!

Rub-a-dub in a dancehall style...

Irie, Mon...

Salmoneye


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:52:46       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Salmoneye, I always had long hair and a beard, even in high school. About 5 years ago I decided to stop brushing my hair. I figured I spent an hour a year or so brushing. So now I have this accumulated time to do something really fun with. Just haven't figured out what it is yet.


Salmoneye    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:03:12       [Reply]  [Send Email]
I had long hair for 12 years...Shaved bald 2 years ago May 30th...

It is almost all back...They can cut it for my funeral...Never again...Not so much as a trim...

Sampson was right...

;-)


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:06:45       [Reply]  [Send Email]
But I'm getting bald on top. Need to do the flip thing with a few of my knots!


Ludwig    Posted 03-05-2003 at 08:16:18       [Reply]  [No Email]
When I first started college one of my favorite profs had a long pony tail, down maybe to his belt. He was pushing the high side of his 40's and his hair was getting pretty thin. We were all pretty surprised when he cut it short, but his explanation was that he didn't really want to look like a dog with mange and would rather attempt to scrape up some dignity as he aged. He did in fact look better with it short. By the time I graduated he didn't have much hair left, and I think the ponytail would have been pretty scraggly...


bob ny    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:55:48       [Reply]  [No Email]
but that tine is all gone now you must have wastrd it on your job


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:58:12       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Or maybe spent it here with you fine people.


bob ny    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:34:16       [Reply]  [No Email]
ouch


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 06:39:51       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Meant it kindly.


Cindi    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:39:45       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Lol! Dreds are a tough one. Blame hollywood again. The 'Predator' had dreds. However, many happy, smiley, peace loving, easy going jamaicans also have dreds. Don't worry, mon, be happy.


Randy    Posted 03-05-2003 at 05:43:22       [Reply]  [Send Email]
Cindi, I have looked like this for a very long time. For me it kept the unwanteds away.
You know I'm happy, giddy with delight in being me.


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